Bad things

Discussion in 'New York' started by jmp, Jun 8, 2001.

Draft saved Draft deleted
  1. wsb

    wsb

    Messages:
    523
    Good post Hofstra.

    The interesting thing is that people who are truly proficient in the martial arts, especially the Japanese martial arts (karate, Iaido, Kendo, etc.), where the strength of one's Ki is placed on an equal plateau with one's fighting technique, such people rarely - if ever - end up in any sort of street fight or similar conflict.

    Obtaining such enlightenment though takes many years of mental and physical training, which is why for the average person the first objective should be to avoid or escape from harm, only resorting to fighting when there is no other alternative.

    --WSB
  2. mercydancer

    mercydancer

    Messages:
    755
    \
    In the gods I trust, all others need cash.LOl
  3. hofstra14

    hofstra14

    Messages:
    12
    I agree with Mercy that a key is knowing when to fight and when to run. That goes for anybody, male or female regardless of size and/or martial arts training. Years ago an instructor told me that the best fights are the ones that don't happen either because of attitude (Musashi's 5 Rings) or Airborne/Special Forces/Recon (I fear not because I am the baddest mother @#$%er in the valley of death!) or Sun Tzu ('if the opponent is superior retreat' or something like that anyway). This guy was one serious dude (3rd place 1968 World TKD Championships Heavyweight) and even he knew when to just walk away. Although I doubt very few people chased him!

    Anyway where do I apply for my Puerto Rican Express Card? <lol> And does Mercy accept the card?
  4. mercydancer

    mercydancer

    Messages:
    755

    like I said: LOTS of street smarts training.That includes knowing when to run for cover.

    I don't fashion myself with being Wonderwoman or anything like that(though I have been told that I am wonderful),but I do pride myself on my common sense. And if that doesn't seem to work, oh well ,then you have no choice but to get busy.Even if your ass gets kicked.
  5. jmp

    jmp

    Messages:
    511
    Don't lots of hotel rooms have in-room safes nowadays, or have I been spending too much time in Vegas?

    If a lady keeps all of the proceeds from her previous visitors in the room's safe, while putting the current payment in her handbag (or whatever), she reduces the amount the guy can take from her...
  6. Ozzy

    Ozzy

    Messages:
    15,725
    well that goes without saying that none of the girls should leave money laying around or let it (if in their pockbook or jacket) out of their sight.

    but suposedly gerald never has any money. so if you ask up front and he has nothing or not enough......

    if my friend had done that, then greald wouldn't have been able to take her money(from a previous call) later when she wasn't looking.
  7. Slinky Bender

    Slinky Bender The All Powerful Moderator

    Messages:
    19,483
    The reason for not accepting the fee up front is the belief that LE could not commit a sexual act, and then arrest. Therefore, if you don't collect the fee till afterwards, and you don't discuss it, you can't be charged because you didn't discuss/commit "prostitution" and then take money for sex from anyone who could testify against you. There are two problems with that theory, however:

    1) In another jurisdiction ( DC suburbs ? ), LE has used "informants" who "went all the way" and then busted the places, and

    2) LE doesn't need evidence of "the act" to arrest. All the things that lead up to the appointment are enough evidence to arrest, in that the "contract" has been negotiated enough to charge.

    However, Ozzy, I think you are aware that sometimes the problem occurs even after the fee has been collected, no ?????

    [Edited by slinkybender on 06-12-2001 at 08:27 PM]
  8. Ozzy

    Ozzy

    Messages:
    15,725
    how about simply settling things ($) up front. that would at least deter gerald or whatever his name is.


    and since most providers are found and contacted thru these boards, i would think everyone would understand at this point. you're gonna pay eventually....it's not like a dinner, where if it's served to you burnt you're not paying or yor paying half....
  9. justme

    justme <i>pop and click tainted</i> Vinyl ( is dead )

    Messages:
    9,566
    Simple suggestions like Scottie's are more likely to be effective than taking down bogus information (which might lead to fals senses of security).
  10. ScottieDS

    ScottieDS

    Messages:
    118
    Provider Safety

    A simple suggestion to indy providers, which hopefully most already do, but for those who don't...

    Make a phone call (or at least pretend to) at the start and the end of the session.

    You should make sure the customer knows you are calling a "friend", who likes to know where you are and that you are OK, and if this friend does not hear from you at the end of the scheduled time, he/she will be become worried.

    Obviously, this should not be a big deal, but just a subtle reminder that your not all alone and vulnerable.

    Any customer who doesn't understand that this is for your safety (especially on the first visit), is an a-hole.

    I'm not sure if this would deter the specific a-hole who has been mentioned previously, and this is no guarantee of safety, but if I were a female in the business, I would do this with every first time customer.

    Sorry to those who may feel I'm stating the obvious, but I've been with indy providers who don't do this, and suggest they should.

    My 0.02

    Regards,
    ScottieDS
  11. wsb

    wsb

    Messages:
    523
    Mercy --

    Then I'm sure you probably know a lot of people with big mouths who often get their assets kicked?? At least I knew a few in my neighborhood growing up.

    I'm not trying to be argumentative. Indeed, I agree that proper attitude is a good way to avoid being a victim in the first place (check out Musashi's "Book of Five Rings"), but when the sh*t hits the fan your first thought should be how to get out of that situation - not how to teach that person a lesson - that part comes later once you've restored the balance of power.

    Regards,

    WSB
  12. candie

    candie

    Messages:
    1,614
    ROFLMAS!!!! your so cute mercy!
  13. mercydancer

    mercydancer

    Messages:
    755
  14. wsb

    wsb

    Messages:
    523
    JM is correct. You can have his tax returns and his college transcripts and unless they are wrapped around a heavy object, they will do little good to the provider in a confrontation. At *best*, such info provides a means of recourse for the provider *after* she has been attacked. The police *will* assist you if you have been assaulted, so all that baloney about needing a complaint to have been filed doesn't make sense. If you are in any sort of reputable hotel and you made any sort of noice, there is a good chance that they will be called any way.

    If as a provider you are involved in a financial dispute (i.e., your client doesn't pay you), you need to get with the program and start collecting your fee up-front or write-off the loss as a bad debt if you choose to do otherwise. The police will not help you collect your lost or stolen fees (even if prostitution were legal, the lack of payment would be a civil matter, not criminal). By the way, it is my understanding that Gerald's mo is to avoid payment by making any number of excuses, not assault, so guys like Gerald are very easily foiled by establishing up-front payment terms and sticking with them.

    Regarding the topic of assault, most girls who have been assaulted don't take any action. Many non-Internet-savvy girls just write-off such attacks as "part of the business" and the net-savvy ladies seem to mostly pursue this pointless process of outing the john and stirring-up this faux vigilante justice that ew correctly alludes to in his post, that again accomlishes absolutley nothing. Most of these well-meaning but misguided board contributors are just stroking their egos or seeking to curry favour with the provider in question or providers in general.

    What providers often don't realize though, is that if one of these guys actually pursues the matter, the situation has a good probability of getting worse rather than better. The most likely scenario is that the vigilante ends up getting hurt and perhaps arrested, and you can be sure that the trail will lead straight back to the provider. If this misguided soul actually manages to exact some sort of vigilante vengeance upon the [correct] individual, there is a good possibility that this will lead LE (or someone worse) back to the provider's door as well.

    The bottom line is to minimize the potential for assault by screening your prospective clients, not through the gathering of pointless info that can easily be faked, but rather by having some ability to read people and discern their motives. As previously suggested, you should take 20 minutes or so to meet new clients in a bar or other safe public but discreet spot for a [soft]drink and a chat. If you have been doing this for a while and have a decent ability to read people, your intuition is probably sufficient to keep you out of most problematic situations. If you are new to the business or completely clueless when it comes to people, then work for an incall agency where there is at least the appearance of security to limit your exposure. Outcall, "booking agencies" are unlikely to offer much in terms of security sufficient to deter harmful people.

    Obviously, none of the foregoing suggestions are foolproof, so you must assume that you will eventually run into some unpleasant characters and should plan accordingly. Plan in advance how you will deal (i.e., how you will get away and/or how you will alert people to help you, not how you'll use leverage that free Tae Kwon Do class from the Y) with an attempted assault and who you will call thereafter. Don't wait until something happens to think about this.

    Be well,

    WSB
  15. justme

    justme <i>pop and click tainted</i> Vinyl ( is dead )

    Messages:
    9,566
    Badz - I'm not questioning the right of a providor to 'verify', my only point was that we've clearly seen that even a strict verification process (how many of us are willing to give out more than our driver's liscence?) is likely to be overcome by a determined thief. So if the verification processes don't actually stop the people that are meant to be stopped, what good are they?
  16. badz

    badz Bronze

    Messages:
    99
    as far as gerald likes to make last minutes appointment, that's not true all the time. He had made appointments prior to katrina sweet's first time visit arrival here. they've exchanged emails. he made two appointments just to make her feel at eased, and one of the appointments was her first one, few hours after she got off the plane. so provider's willingness to make last minutes appointment is not the only tatic that he used.
  17. badz

    badz Bronze

    Messages:
    99
    ew,
    you are absolutely right, bitching will not get us anywhere, and that includes me. but how do you know that i'm not doing something right now? *sorry bout the editing, i'm setting something up right now, if you had read the unedited message, fine. but i don't want to give too much details away, that will defeat the purpose of setting things up...*
    things are unsolveable.... if you don't even try.
    we'll see if he takes the bait...

    [Edited by badz on 06-11-2001 at 08:53 AM]
  18. Tankcommander

    Tankcommander

    Messages:
    357
    Statutes of limitations...

    Don't apply here, so lately doesn't matter.



    [Edited by Tankcommander on 06-11-2001 at 02:57 AM]
  19. TravisBickle

    TravisBickle

    Messages:
    4
    What kind of crimes have this Gerald committed lately?
  20. ew

    ew Silver

    Messages:
    485
    Well gee Badz, looks like Gerald was verified thus the license. A lot of good that did. Work number verification? There are services that will do this.

    Perhaps people should stroking their egos (strutting?)pretending to be able to protect the women. I know what I said won't be too popular, but this problem comes up every so often and nothing ever gets done. I think Mercy did say that the wits of the provider and her instincts are the best ward against this evil. Many provider are available 12 to 12, multiply that by x providers that's an aweful lot of cover to provide. But, as I said earlier, I feel that the extra information required is likely to decrease the pool of clients. From what is said of Gerald he preys on the providers willingness to do last minute bookings. Booking=money.
    Since at the moment this is his SOP, this type of client should be filtered out by the provider. Nobody else can act as the gatekeeper at this last step.

    Now you know other people have differing opinions, so instead of you bitching about others not sharing your view the onus is on you. Why don't you do something (besides bitch)?

    I feel for the ladies, but this problem (in general) is very close to unsolvable. Escorting is based on people having anonymous liaisons.