good tidings to all

Discussion in 'General Industry Related Topics' started by guy catelli, Jan 15, 2001.

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  1. guy catelli

    guy catelli

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    478
    touche'! Ozzy

  2. Thorn

    Thorn

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    7,771
    Gee, and people say *I* am verbose.

    Guy,

    With all due respect, and candor, you are a spectacular example of a man with way too much free time on your hands.

    Even so, I wish you well.
  3. Ozzy

    Ozzy

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    15,725
    Re: transactionalists vs. collaborativists




    guy, my gold ranking.........comes from the ladies. ;)

    [Edited by Ozzy on 01-20-2001 at 08:35 PM]
  4. guy catelli

    guy catelli

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    478
    keepin' it brief ...

  5. Rufus Moses

    Rufus Moses

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    549
    GC, your posts are simply too long. I didn't read the one above.

    And I don't want to argue why your romantic/cynic paradigm is
    not useful or accurate.

    But accepting it just for the moment, it seems to me that there is a simple reason why romantics report more mileage than cynics. Romantics are "the glass is half full" types. Cynics are "the glass is half empty" types. But both are getting the same glass.
  6. guy catelli

    guy catelli

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    478
    how so?

  7. Phantom

    Phantom

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    2,806
    God, you give me a spliting headache
  8. guy catelli

    guy catelli

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    478
    transactionalists vs. collaborativists

    Originally posted by fletch

    I wish I could claim such an interesting genesis for my screen name. Unfortunately, I took it from the Chevy Chase movie. And although I've read all of the Gregory McDonald books, I can't pretend to have read them first.

    i take it that you are a tarheel?

    That's a lot to assume and I disagree.

    okay. technically, it would have been more accurate for me to have written that cynics tend to *report* lower mileage than do Romantics. and, there is no doubt a certain amount of exaggeration coming from both sides. but, even if we were to adopt the most cynical assumption of all, ie, that money is not the *most* important thing ... it's the *only* thing, the incontrovertible fact is that Romantics report more repeat visits to the subject of their Romanticism. if we adopt the cynical view that "they vote with their pocketbooks", and if Romantics aren't getting high mileage, why do they keep going back to the same vehicle of pleasure, instead of constantly shopping around for another model with different features, as cynics report themselves doing?

    In my opinion, 99% of "mileage" is realized as a result of what happens behind closed doors.

    agreed. in fact, i think *100%* of mileage is the result of what goes on behind closed doors. but, i don't think there's any way to leave *all* of one's backage behind when the doors are closed. and, heavy baggage tends to be a drag on mileage.

    I don't think anyone is in a position to talk about what mileage you, I or anyone gets in a session.

    if i've been out with escorts X, Y, and Z, and other Romantics report the same great mileage i got from these escorts, and the cynics report very low mileage, i think that it is reasonable to generalize from this about a 'tendency'. like any generalization about people, it can never be true about all people at all times. but, i don't think it can be dismissed out-of-hand, either.

    Bluntly speaking, because you both {are} on the same side of the dollar.

    that may be ... but, we're not on the same side of the *bedsheets*. and, therein lies a not insignificant distinction between this thing of ours and, say, the decision on whether to purchase a Nikon or a Canon.

    i'm really glad you posed the issue in this way. because it illuminates the discussion we were having about client categorzation. please correct me if i am mistaken, but i gather that you feel that the Jock vs. Romantic distinction is not a particularly accurate or useful reflection of the relevant differences in client types.

    and yet, it seems clear that there is *some* sort of 'great divide', and that there is a persistent antagonism between clients on either side of this divide. each type seems to feel that the other not only "doesn't get it", but is actually subverting the 'real' purpose of the undertaking.

    i would like to propose a dualism that i think (and hope) does justice to both types. the distinction i am proposing will not only clarify what are the really essential differences between the two types, but, hopefully, suggest, or at least imply, ways in which both types can live in comity on the same asp board.

    i would sketch the outline of these alternative paradigms as follows:

    1. the buyer and a seller of adult services; and

    2. the two collaborators in a work of improvisational jazz.

    for short, the 'transactional' paradigm and the 'collaborative' paradigm. i'm not saying either paradigm must or should ultimately prevail over the other. whatever way works for oneself is always the best way. i'd just like to hold the two paradigms together side by side so that all may examine them, and perhaps find something useful in each.

    in the standard transactional paradigm, each side seeks to gain as much from the other as possible, in exchange for as little as possible. this is 'economic rationality', plain and simple. as the old advertising slogan would put it: why pay *more*?

    under the transactional paradigm, the Consumer Reports (CR) type of review is the ideal. indeed, CR is almost 'puritanical' (ahem) in its approach to reviewing products and services. it never identifies itself to the seller when purchasing products for testing and review, lest this alter the product or service the vendor provides. it accepts no advertising, to avoid the appearance of conflict of interest. and, it vigorously litigates (and successfully so) against the use of its reviews in the advertising of those who have been favorably reviewed, lest its reviews be used for 'shilling'.

    the collaborative approach is not as easily analogized, but i'll give it a try. say, for example, i have a love of playing jazz piano (in reality, i can't even type, much less play piano :-( but, i have neither the talent nor the inclination to attempt to do so professionally. and yet, i fantasize about being an accompaniest with this or that female vocalist.

    now, believe it or not, Cybill Shepard is a pop vocalist http://images.amazon.com/images/P/0060193506.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg who can win over a skeptical new york niteclub audience, as i had the pleasure of witnessing myself one evening. so, suppose Cybill were to make herself available as a vocalist for hire for private sessions with amateur pianists?

    to continue the analogy, the transactionalist might find it vitally important to know whether she would be willing to sing a demanding aria from Wagner, or hold a high E above C from Aida, or whether she 'cheats' by singing below the scored register, etc.

    whereas, the collaborator would be relatively indifferent to 'objective' reviews of what she did do and what she didn't. the primary concern of the objectivist would be her professional ethics, eg, was it really Cybill or was a substitue sent in her stead; did she stay the allotted time; did she stop to take phone calls; etc.

    as long as she were on the up-and-up professionally speaking, i don't care if a hundred transactionalists wrote that she wouldn't belt out "that's why the lady is a tramp" or "ain't nobody's business if i do". based upon my own experience in these matters, i'd still be willing to bet the price of admission that she would knock my socks off.

    why? well, it's not really a great mystery, when you think about it. a good jazz performer picks up on the fact that what they're attempting to do is 'working' for me. like any other performer, they play their hardest for listeners who have willingly fallen under their spell -- not for those in the audience who are cynical or indifferent.

    <i>I understand that the services a girl will offer may vary. But if I see five reviews that all say "she doesn't kiss", I think it is a logical assumption that she isn't going to kiss me.
    My point is that posting details about these services are the best means for any of us to learn what she will or won't do. We can all make our own decisions from there.</i>

    but, as the song says, "a kiss is just a kiss".

    that's not really the problem. the problem is more like: ~first i boinked her up the butt (uncovered) ... then she sucked me off! a real *pig* -- but for 60 bucks, who cares!?!~

    but, okay, a transactionalist absolutely *has* to, *has* to, *has* to know if she will do this or won't do that. fine. the pros and cons of this have been debated endlessly.

    but, the longer you are at this, the more likely you are to eventually realize that most escorts didn't get into escorting because they are sexually inhibited. on the contrary, most of them will do almost *anything* if they're in the mood to; and almost *nothing* if they're not. my intuition is that it's not likely that seeing themselves reviewed with a 'checklist of features' (like a Consumer Reports review of power tools for the basement workshop) will increase the likelihood of their wanting to 'bend their rules' a little.

    but, i don't want to give away too much. Ozzy might to try to use it to get a gold ranking from the committee ;-)
  9. fletch

    fletch Voice of Reason

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    197
    Ozzy, you're right - the second movie blew dog. Unlike the first, it was not based on one of McDonald's novels.
  10. Ozzy

    Ozzy

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    15,725
    you mean i blew him and all i got was this stinking shirt?

    oops, wrong punch line..........


    now he's really AFH.



    btw, jf......i wasn't kidding. but at least he's better than the veal.
  11. frog

    frog

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    1,059
    Oz, I thought silver is HJ, gold is BJ [what we are trying to avoid], do you really want the platinum? owww
  12. Phantom

    Phantom

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    2,806
    I don't need no stinking silver. I wanna jump straight to platimum.

    Hey SB, I have a pair of Super Bowl tickets are you interested? Free of charge $$$ of course.
  13. guy catelli

    guy catelli

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    478
    how client rankings are assigned

    no problem, JohnFrancis -- that's why i'm here.

    BTW, I notice a few users are now on Silver status. How does one attain Silver status? Is there a gold status too? Is it based on how many posts you've submitted?

    pay no attention to what Ozzy just posted. he's just kidding around. the truth of the matter is that it's based upon how escorts rate you for sexiness.

    the levels, in increasing order of sexual expertise are:

    mercury
    lead
    copper
    tin
    brass
    bronze
    silver
    gold
    platinum
    palladium
    titanium
    uranium
    plutonium
    einsteinium
    proton
    quark
    singularity
    immortal god of love

    there is a committee of highly experienced clients who ultimately decide on the rankings. i'm not at liberty to reveal all of their names, but obviously experts like the APM, Ozzy, and frog are on the committee.

    the committee receives client reviews that escorts from around the world submit on a daily basis. they carefully study each review, and adjust that client's rating accordingly.

    now, you are probably asking yourself: why is it that no one on this board ranks lower than bronze? the answer is simple: the APM is such a distinguished presence in the escort community that the mere fact that a client has registered on UG affords that client a ranking of bronze for sexiness in the eyes of escorts generally.

    and, you are probably wondering why some of the obviously sexy clients, like myself, do not have a higher ranking. again, the answer is simple: some of us are too modest to allow our true ranking to be seen by the public at large. personally, i requested that the APM list my ranking as bronze, in order to indicate that i am just a client among clients.

    btw, there is absolutely no truth to the rumor that Ozzy pays the APM $2000 per month for his silver ranking and his seat on the review committee. that is just a story started by members of another asp board that are jealous of the great success of UG.

    i hope this has helped clarify the matter.

    guy




    [Edited by guy catelli on 01-19-2001 at 05:06 PM]
  14. Ozzy

    Ozzy

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    15,725
    fletch.......i f*cking knew it! but only the first movie was good. btw, chevy sucks now.

    frog.......same here.


    jf.........you gotta blow slinky, still interested?




    ;)
  15. JohnFrancis

    JohnFrancis

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    7
    The Deeper Meaning of Slinkybender

    Boy, do I feel dumb. I too thought he enjoyed distorting springs.

    BTW, I notice a few users are now on Silver status. How does one attain Silver status? Is there a gold status too? Is it based on how many posts you've submitted?
  16. frog

    frog

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    1,059
    ozzy, MrNY, and I get the most mileage, by being "generously romantic".
  17. fletch

    fletch Voice of Reason

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    197
    I wish I could claim such an interesting genesis for my screen name. Unfortunately, I took it from the Chevy Chase movie. And although I've read all of the Gregory McDonald books, I can't pretend to have read them first.

    That's a lot to assume and I disagree. In my opinion, 99% of "mileage" is realized as a result of what happens behind closed doors. I don't think anyone is in a position to talk about what mileage you, I or anyone gets in a session.

    Bluntly speaking, because you both on the same side of the dollar.

    I understand that the services a girl will offer may vary. But if I see five reviews that all say "she doesn't kiss", I think it is a logical assumption that she isn't going to kiss me. My point is that posting details about these services are the best means for any of us to learn what she will or won't do. We can all make our own decisions from there.
  18. Ozzy

    Ozzy

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    15,725
    wow, i am stupid. and i thought he broke little kids toys for a hobby.
  19. guy catelli

    guy catelli

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    478
    "so what about slinkybender?..."

    i had always assumed that the APM's screen name's primary referent was Slinky Bender -- a sax player who worked the jazz clubs and strip joints of the mid- and southwest from the late 30s to early 50s. he greatly enjoyed the sporting life, and was quite popular with the strippers and other 'ladies' who worked in the clubs.

    at one point, Bender had his own jazz club and band. there are very few of his recordings still available, but they come up for auction on ebay from time to time.
  20. Ozzy

    Ozzy

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    15,725
    so what about slinkybender........a guy who breaks metal spring toys?