What to do when she cancels on you??...

Discussion in 'General Industry Related Topics' started by mr. wonderful, Jan 20, 2001.

Draft saved Draft deleted
  1. Slinky Bender

    Slinky Bender The All Powerful Moderator

    Messages:
    19,478
    OK, here's where I go preaching again ( even though no one listens ):

    Part of the point of the "NEED SOMETHING TODAY" board is to help out for just the situations where there are people who stand people up. I know I keep harping on it, but it still isn't working.

    What I would expect is that the ladies who are here ( not just the posters, but all those lurkers who I know are reading this ), would simply peek in at that board first thing whenever they log on. if there is a post that indicates an appointment you can handle, jus tsend teh guy an email and tell him you are available. IT'S THAT SIMPLE. I would imagine that after things get up and running, that most of you would be able to fill in a large percentage of your "no shows" and late cancellations, and not lose nearly as much money from these little mishaps.

    But, it will only work if both sides use it.......
  2. San_Te

    San_Te

    Messages:
    167
    I agree Slinky. Unfortunately, the whole situation was a mess. I really feel bad for the other guys still waiting for her return. However, I did learn one thing. Under no circumstances do I ever give a deposit.
  3. ValerieXXX

    ValerieXXX

    Messages:
    69
    Good topic, ready for 500+ posts?...lol.....
    MR wonderful, if you had made a deposit, and the lady cancelled, well you should get it back!!! It is just good business.
    I rarely ever take deposits unless I am being flown in by one person. That makes sense for me to do because, I am laying out my cash to get to the appointment until I get compensated. Now I can't speak for others, but anyone who does not honor their part of the bargain, either escort or client, is not a good person at all. I have seen too many cases where touring pros went into bankruptcy because of no shows and last minute cancellations. Now who the hell are these people, you bet if it happened to them they would be the first to cry foul!!! There are some who do not see us as business professionals and think it is ok to stand up a lady, well they should be held accountable just as providers are. You think providers are the only ones you are wrong. At least in some cases if the appointment was cancelled with some decent time then that is one thing, also keep in mind, that some of us have kids, and I had to cancel a date because my son was being rushed to the emergency room. Now anyone got a beef with that, just has no heart in their entire body, sometimes our families must come first, and you don't know that this could be the reason caus there was no time to explain. Lighten up dudes!
  4. Slinky Bender

    Slinky Bender The All Powerful Moderator

    Messages:
    19,478
    I'd like to leave a deposit with Hannah......hehehe.

    Sorry, my fans would have been disappointed if i didn't do that.....

    I think that anyone, in any business, needs to refund deposits when they must cancel. The phrase "it's our policy" is used by a lot of businesses to pull a lot of shit that they have no business pulling. A few years a go I went to a bar/restaurant and ordered off the menu the "Pint of Ale". When it arrived, it was a glass that was cleary not a pint. I said to the waiter "Excuse me, this is not a pint". His response was "Well, that's 'our' pint". I tried to explain to him that a pint was a unit of measure, and not up for "interperetation", but he simply kept saying "well, that's 'our' pint". So, when I left, I gave him a single and told him "well, that's my five dollar bill". When he protested I invited him to call the police and we could talk about his pint and my payment.

    Lot's of businesses think that they can tell you "that's the way we do it" and that makes it ok. You always get "well, that's our standard contract". Don't ever sign their "standard contract". Their attorney spent plenty of time designing that contract to make all their rights enforcable and to fuck you. Did you know that the Standard Form of Lease for a Condominium in New York says that a) if the landlord decides to sell the unit, you have to get out in 30 days, and b) if the landlord's Common Charges or Real Estate Taxes are increased, they get to pass that along to the tenant ? Now, even most Condo owners are not aware of these clauses, but they are in there because.........who pays for the Leases ?

    Back on topic, my personal feeling is that if you schedule an appointment with a specified date and time, and the appointement gets cancelled, the implied contract for any appointment is cancelled and funds should be returned. You are under no obligation to reschedule a new appointment ( hell, you might not want to see the person solely because of the cancelleatin, and I think it is your right to make such a decision ).

    I think one thing which happens with some businesses is that they use the deposits when they receive them. They then don't have them to return when they cancel. It becomes difficult for them to "reach into their pockets" then, to come up with the funds to refund deposits. I think this practice is what causes some of the problems. In NY, security deposits on appartments must be kept segregated in accounts solely for that purpose, and no "co-mingling" with other funds is allowed. If touring pro's kept separate accounts with deposits and only transferred the funds to an "opperating account" after the appointment, some of the problems would "go away" ( yeah, I know, they don't call it "Utopia" guide for nothin' ).

    All that said, I have no idea about Hannah, and as such the foregoing should be taken as a general statement, having nothing to do with her in particular.
  5. San_Te

    San_Te

    Messages:
    167
    I guess it is time to make my first post on this board.

    I agree with you Slinky, but what about the girls who cancel their tours and then refuse to refund deposits because it is their "policy"? I had this problem with Hannah. I know there are many still waiting for her to make good on deposits she is still holding. It is touring girls like this which make guys very hesitant on making deposits. I now refuse to make a deposit under any circumstances.
  6. fletch

    fletch Voice of Reason

    Messages:
    197
    sb, I agree with all but the last paragraph. Therapists typically see patients repeatedly and at regular intervals, so cancellations have a different impact to these folks. For example, if someone is going to get their back cracked every week for six months, odds are that they would miss a few sessions without the "you pay anyway" rule. Particularly after it becomes routine - they feel better, twice a month is just as good, etc. Imagine the poor psychologist who is treating someone with avoidant personality disorder manifesting itself in habitual procrastination!

    I think a better analogy is a doctor's appointment. I've never had a doctor that charged for missed appointments. Maybe there are exceptions, i.e. a top-tier specialist. (But I have one of the best ENT's in the city and even he doesn't do this.)

    If I am 30 mins late for a one hour session with a girl, I only expect 30 mins from her. But if I had to cancel...I'm sorry but that's just part of the business. Touring girls are different and I would have no problem forfeiting a reasonable deposit in that case. But I've never done the deposit thing and I doubt I would.

    BTW, you are absolutely right on the refund issue. It is not acceptable to cancel and hold deposits because you think you are only delaying your trip for two weeks. Two weeks can easily become three months and even if that weren't the case, it is not fair to assume that everyone would be still be available.
  7. Slinky Bender

    Slinky Bender The All Powerful Moderator

    Messages:
    19,478
    My thoughts won't come close to coving all the answers, bit I'll just bring up a few issues.

    First, let me say, that I have a similar view of all professionals, and yes I do think that doctors, attorneys, etc. should be "held accountable" when the act in similar ways.

    Anyway, one thing about guys cancelling: it is well settled in law that "security deposits" ( which is what I consider these advance session payments to be akin to ), are only good against actual damages. As such, I think that if a guy cancels and the lady is able to re-book the hour(s), it is unethical to keep the deposit ( yes ,it's almost impossible for a guy to prove, but ethics aren't about proof, they're about what's right ).

    Another thing I have noticed on occasion: a "touring pro" makes plans to visit a city, books hours and takes deposits. For some reason ( good, bad, whatever ) they cancel the trip. They fail to immediately notify the people who they have booked and immediately return all depostis. If you have to cancel, I believe it is your responsibility to make all the contacts and go through whatever expense/action is necessary to get your clients back their funds. It doesn't matter how good the reason is that you have to cancel, if it's you that's doing the cancelling, you don't get to penalize the other side for it.

    However, that cuts both ways. If you have set up an appointment, someone has blocked out that time for you, and possibly has foregone ther income opportunities. The standard practice for Therapists/Psycholigists/etc. had been that the hour is yours, whether youshow up or not, and that you get billed. In fact, if your hour is 11AM to Noon, and you show up at 11:30AM, you get 11:30 to Noon and get to pay for an hour. This comes into play in the hobby, too. Let's say you have booked a 3PM with someone for an hour. You get there late ( 3:30 ). Now, she has booked another client at 5PM, figuring it's plenty of time between appointments. But now, if she says at 4:30PM "hours up", she runs the risk of being labled a "clockwatcher" ( and she certainly needs some time between appointments to freshen up, etc ). So, what's she supposed to do ?

    More later........
  8. mr. wonderful

    mr. wonderful

    Messages:
    206
    There seems to be a double standard in this industry, one which has troubled me for sometime. If we, as gentlemen, cancel on a young lady without sufficient notice, for whatever reason, some circles believe that the lady is entitled to a cancellation fee at least, and sometimes payment in full. This very issue has caused me to part company with certain "friends" on other "boards".

    Now just today I discovered that a young lady I was to see next week has cancelled her appointment with me. Honestly, this causes me no great hardship, but it raises the question again....why as men should we pay for sessions when ample cancellation is given, when women like the one to which I am referring think nothing of any repercussions of cancelling. Now this person gave me ample time to acknowledge her inability to keep our appt., but only because I called into my office for my messages. If I had not, I would not have discovered this until Monday, two days before our appointment.

    Why then is it the feeling of some that we, as gentlemen, are more or less obligated of making at least a token gesture of payment for appts. cancelled well in advance, while ladies can postpone or cancel appts. on us at their leisure with no fear of repercussion or no obligation on their part other to just say "sorry".

    What are the feelings of the general public on this matter? I know the obvious answer is because they are the service provider, but I think that there is more to it than that. If I am expected to pay for a session I did not have, why then should I not expect some consideration if the same happens to me?

    Thanks for listening and sorry to be so long winded.

    MW